Odious

Snoogans began his One Degree of Separation (ODS) Project a year ago in conjunction with GeoWoodstock IV.

Each regular cache that is given away (200-250, or possibly more) will contain a log, a pencil, and at least 20-50, or more, log only, micro “seed caches” as part of the “One Degree of Separation Project.” When the regular caches have all been handed out, I will have some extra micro caches for the rest of the attendees. No one will leave empty handed if I can help it. My main concern is that the regular (seed pod) caches be placed 20 miles, or more, (ATCF: As the crow flies.) apart to prevent over-saturation of ODS caches in the local geocaching continuums.

The idea was to see how many folks could connect to Snoogans (a la Bacon number) via these caches in as few steps as possible:

The ultimate stated goal of ODS is to connect the entire geocaching continuum to one point in as few degrees of separation as possible. One degree being the most desired goal.

Snoogans then asked on the GC.com fora:

Thoughts? Comments? Questions? If you have NEVER heard of this project, I’d really like to hear from YOU. smile.gif

All I ask is one favor. Before you flame the idea, take a look at the caches in the project (on ODS: PRIME!’s profile) and look closely at what the hiders and finders are saying about the project all over the world. I know it’s allot to ask from the micro haters, but please give the project a look before you condemn it as micro-spew and cast your fears upon the next phase in the project before you even find out what it is. mellow.gif

Snoogans appears to be an affable guy. I have nothing against him personally. What I have noticed both at GC.com and TC.com is that he is quite opinionated. Notice that his question takes a shot at micro haters.

While there are some folks who do not like micros, the people addressed here are those note that the proliferation of poor caches tend to be micros. The “other side” never gives this argument merit and hence are labeled. He has set up his defense for the backlash that he knows is coming.

As you read through the thread, Snoogans employs what many forum bullies do; namely, shouting down any dissent and labeling. No one can voice displeasure with his launching 12,500 film canisters. If you note they leak, he tells you that is the fault of the finder.

Often the problem with wet micros is NOT the person who hid the cache in the first place, but the careless person who rehid it.

If you state that you don’t understand how 12,500 film canisters is “fun, you are labeled a micro hater:

(Snoogans @ May 20 2007, 08:50 AM)

This project is about FUN while using some interesting statistical data to illustrate the concept.

(CoyoteRed @ May 20 2007, 08:22 AM)

Again, I guess I don’t get it. What’s “fun” about micro-spew?

(Snoogans)
No. You don’t get it and that’s okay. You’ve illustrated your blind hatred of micros quite well. dry.gif

And so it goes as one challenges the project. There is no way to convince one the project is flawed because there’s always a response at hand.

My comment about the project is different than what I have heard voiced previously. ODS is a huge ego trip. The whole point is to link to one cacher. And while Snoogans is not shy and is known outside his area via his forum posts (and events attended in several states), most cachers know nothing of him.

His “social experiment” is to push out 12,500 film canisters in hopes of folks linking to him. He admitted that originally the names of the caches would have Snoogans in it. Fortunately, that changed.

Much like first finders claiming their accomplishment and RK wanting to claim he is king of the mountain using comparative statistics, I find Snoogans’ project nothing but a “look at me” project. Beginning a thread that essentially says, “look at me” and then shouting down the dissent pretty much confirms it.

It appears that the current theme in the community is boasting. I find the practice abhorrent.

Also blogged on this date . . .

10 thoughts on “Odious”

  1. Snoogans responded to my argument:

    Have fun with it or don’t, but please, for the literally thousands of finders and hundreds of hiders, DON’T just dismiss it as ego.

    Unfortunately, this response does not hold water. The project is about his ego. Furthermore it is about broadcasting that ego far and wide.

    One cannot rely upon “literally thousands of finders and hundreds of hiders” to support his response. Just as he denigrates those who claim film canisters inspire poor caches for stating that the caches would have been placed regardless of ODS, the finders and hiders would have existed regardless of the 12,500 film canisters.

    The goal has always been about Snoogans. He created it, organized it, distributed it, is flaunting it. But he doesn’t want to be responsible for the negativity associated with it. He’ll shout down what he can and dismiss the rest as not mattering.

    There are still 12,500 canisters linked to one player and that is a legacy he is stuck with.

  2. Snoogans appears only interested in opinions he can shout down. When asked a legitimate question, he begs off.

    Are you going to answer my question? I thought it was a fair question…

    Actually, no. I hadn’t planned to answer that. Your question wasn’t so much of a question. It was more like Monday morning quarterbacking. The project is what it is not what you think it should be.

  3. I placed an ODS cache in Darlington Park, not far from home. I hadn’t been reading the forums so I saw it as a free cache container, nothing else.

  4. Snoogans continues to fail to see the “other side”. He doesn’t want to accept the responsibility of 12,500 poor containers that others may hide poorly:

    I can’t nor can the project be rationally held accountable for individual hide quality. You can accentuate the negative by attacking the containers, but I’ve proven that efforts were made to release a cache that is worthy of being hidden. These types of containers were in use BEFORE this project was launched.

    Again, a hide is what the individual makes of it. No form of instruction was given about how to hide caches in this project. As pointed out before, the project provided a container, an official log sheet, a suggested page format, and a suggested cache title format.

    I reject your arguments based on individual hides reflecting on the project. Individual hides reflect on the individual and that includes maintenance issues.

    but he wants to use those same individual hides to speak of the success of the project.

    Almost 1 year from launch now and ODS broke 700 caches officially placed as part of the project and it’s still growing by a new cache or two published every day. cool.gif

    Where are they all?
    3 Continents
    12 Countries (including one in Iraq!)
    43 States
    4 Canadian Provinces

    You can’t have it both ways. If the individual hides speak to your success, then the problems with those hides also speak to the failure of the project.

  5. Have you visited any ODS caches?

    I haven’t encountered any problems yet but then again, I’ve only been to one ODS seed cache and one ODS seed pod, so I cannot generalize. Maybe these are the two good ones in the project and the other 12,498 containers reside in a dump next to a Staples store. 🙂

  6. I have found none of the seed caches. I am quite familiar with film canister caches. I find them lacking. They are not waterproof and they do not provide room for trade items.

    Anecdotally, film canisters have been among the most boring caches I have found. I cannot recall one that I can exalt.

    Based on the standards I follow when placing a cache, a film canister fails the container standard.

    IMO, film canisters make lousy containers for caches. Snoogans released 12,500 of them. Based on my experience, those are potentially 12,500 lousy caches. To date it has numbered but 700+.

    Snoogans then opened a thread to highlight his year-old project. He shouted down everyone who did not praise his release of these film canisters.

    Looking more closely at the project than I had originally, I recognized that the project was nothing more than an ego boost for Snoogans. This boasting is a theme I see more and more among players of our game. I called him on it here.

    Besides the egoism of the project, Snoogans has released 12,500 film canisters, which do not meet my standards. I suspect they do not meet many others’ either.

    And just because a film canister can be hidden that does not leak, it does not make it a good hide. I challenge anyone who wants to participate in ODS to consider what participation provides to the caching community.

    Your answer may differ from mine.

  7. Snoogans’s bragging doesn’t affect your game one way or another. It’s best not to pay him any more attention.

    You’re also free to ignore ODS caches, Baby caches, and everything else originating from seed-cache-like projects. I actually see a lot more micro caches not from seed projects than micro caches from seed projects in my travels. ODS caches, in particular, are few and far between in this area.

  8. Actually, it affects my game when I have to begin to sift through those cache listings as I prepare my hunts. Admittedly, that has been minimal thus far.

    I do ignore ODS caches (among others). If you read the thread he posted, he asked for comments. I do not comment on the GC.com; I comment on my own site.

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